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Obliv0n

Institutional purchases will become a threat?

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It is not a secret that various private firms have bought Bitcoin in the last 6 months, MicroStrategy and square are an example, but none is enough for GreyScale, which today has reported that its investment portfolio exceeds 20 billion dollars in cryptocurrencies.

 

This is an alarming figure, considering that exactly a year ago the amount was 2000 million, this has brought to the debate the fact that GreyScale may be attacking the neutrality and decentralization of the network, since it will buy more btc than that is mined monthly.

 

Some defend this on the basis that it benefits price, but it is small investors and traders who will be affected.

 

What do you think about this new chapter in the history of Bitcoin?

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1 hour ago, Obliv0n said:

 

This is an alarming figure, considering that exactly a year ago the amount was 2000 million, this has brought to the debate the fact that GreyScale may be attacking the neutrality and decentralization of the network, since it will buy more btc than that is mined monthly.

 

Have no fear, Grayscale isn't mining bitcoin and only miners could technically affect the decentralization of btc network. Demand of BTC only affects to the price and when the price grows it attracs more miners, making bitcoin network even more secure.

 

They could technically use their btc to suppress the price but at this point it wouldn't make any sense and SEC would probably throw them in jail for artificial market manipulation.

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I see no threat from institutional investments, at least regarding the centralization of Bitcoin. As far as we know, it does not matter how much Bitcoin they own, there is no chance for them to change the rules of the consensus overall to benefit themselves, as banks do with fiat currency. In my view, the only way they could affect the market somehow is by manipulating the price but this does not necessarily could mean a big threat, as there will always be a big interest from hodlers to buy Bitcoin, especially at low price levels.

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Grayscale made Bitcoin available to institutions. These investors are not buying Bitcoin but a share of Grayscale Bitcoin Trust and the only limitation is a 6 month time required to hold before being able to sell in OTC market. 

Grayscale holds the Bitcoin in custody and this Bitcoin is not going to be moved ever. The Bitcoin in Grayscale custody is something like Paypal did, it doesn't move and not going to give access to anyone. It is a big problem for the ownership distribution of Bitcoin as it is not used in ways many were thinking, and it loses many of the features it has.

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There is no threat to the Bitcoin network, this is the miners and the full nodes that are active and they are decentralized being run in thousands of different locations, what is described here it is some centralized authorities that control a big number of the Bitcoin supply and this is their own will what to do with them.

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It is a new chapter, there wasn't ever before so high interest into Bitcoin coming from institutions, this is remarkable achievement in my opinion and nothing to worry about. Bitcoin can be bought by anyone and if these companies want to use Bitcoin to create stocks and sell them in regulated markets this is even better for us, as this opens the gates of mainstream institutional and regulated adoption, without having to regulate Bitcoin directly.

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In my opinion, whoever affects Bitcoin is the deceivers, so I think if private companies or institutions started storing the Bitcoin currency, this I do not consider it a threat because this means an increase in demand for Bitcoin and thus its price increases according to the law of supply and demand and this leads to an increase in the number of miners and I think that the decentralized network of Bitcoin will not  Affected, small investors are affected when they do not study market movement properly and technically

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A threat to the dollar probably as this is the reason institutions are investing in Bitcoin, the obvious weaknesses of the dollar after an extended quantitative easing by the FED. Although I consider the USA the top economy the problem is that americans still think it is only them moving Bitcoin market and as usual make this big mistake to think they are controlling the market. In fact Bitcoin adoption this year was rising very fast in most places in the world and while the dollar is weakened adoption increased more outside the USA than in that country.

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It is not messing with anything, anybody can buy Bitcoin, I disagree with all custodial wallets and grayscale as well as paypal are just that, but also custodial wallets are Coinbase, Binance and all the centralized exchanges that are used by crypto owners to park their cryptocurrencies there, without caring for the advice we are always giving to hold the private keys.

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On 1/2/2021 at 12:05 PM, rekter said:

They could technically use their btc to suppress the price but at this point it wouldn't make any sense and SEC would probably throw them in jail for artificial market manipulation.

@rekter Well, with that I am calmer, the case of the SEC offers some security, although it can collapse markets as in the case of XRP.

 

I hope this has more positive than negative results for everyone from small investors to private firms that are getting involved in the market.

22 hours ago, yonkii said:

A threat to the dollar probably as this is the reason institutions are investing in Bitcoin, the obvious weaknesses of the dollar after an extended quantitative easing by the FED. Although I consider the USA the top economy the problem is that americans still think it is only them moving Bitcoin market and as usual make this big mistake to think they are controlling the market. In fact Bitcoin adoption this year was rising very fast in most places in the world and while the dollar is weakened adoption increased more outside the USA than in that country.

@yonkii It is interesting that you mention the situation of the dollar due to the actions of the FED. I just created a topic that involves world debt and the possibility of bitcoin as a refuge of the collapse of the dollar, you can visit it if you like, greetings!

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The price was looking it will go higher a lot since months ago as during the summer it was the last of the bears that were exterminated and Bitcoin found its way. Meanwhile we have seen institutions buying Bitcoin massively. The threat you see has to do with more Bitcoin being in custody wallets and services and not used in other ways or held in proper wallets with the private keys by the legal owners. However these owners chosen to have someone else hold the Bitcoin for them. They were not planning to use them for the freedom Bitcoin gives to them. They just invested. I don't see any threat to Bitcoin in that.

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I think that greyscale succeeds to buy all the bitcoin and makes it centralized, we the traders will be at a loss because they might cause many people to become skeptical and leave bitcoin which will lower the price.

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36 minutes ago, cryptovlek said:

The price was looking it will go higher a lot since months ago as during the summer it was the last of the bears that were exterminated and Bitcoin found its way. Meanwhile we have seen institutions buying Bitcoin massively. The threat you see has to do with more Bitcoin being in custody wallets and services and not used in other ways or held in proper wallets with the private keys by the legal owners. However these owners chosen to have someone else hold the Bitcoin for them. They were not planning to use them for the freedom Bitcoin gives to them. They just invested. I don't see any threat to Bitcoin in that.

@cryptovlek I have no problem with the fact that bitcoins are "frozen" in protected wallets, my question is based, so to speak, on what could happen when these institutions decide to liquidate their assets, it is clear that it currently benefits the market but after that, what do we have left? 

greetings😅

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32 minutes ago, Obliv0n said:

@cryptovlek I have no problem with the fact that bitcoins are "frozen" in protected wallets, my question is based, so to speak, on what could happen when these institutions decide to liquidate their assets, it is clear that it currently benefits the market but after that, what do we have left? 

greetings😅

Oh thanks for the explanation friend. About that, there is grayscale where most institutions are buying Bitcoin, but I haven't heard of Grayscale ever selling any. The Bitcoin trust exists for many years since 2013 I think that Grayscale never sold any Bitcoin back to someone. Perhaps some only to cover expenses and take profit but not those that belong to their clients. It gives to the institution a share of their trust alled GBTC. This is what the institutions can sell later at a regulated OTC exchange. But Grayscale won't be buying this share, there is this market where deep pocket investors are trading.

So, it goes like this.

->Grayscale is buying as institutions ask for Bitcoin.

->It holds the Bitcoin forever in its custody and gives a share of the Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (GBTC) to the institution.

->Institutions can trade at OTC (over the counter) exchange. 

This is a legal representation of a Bitcoin. So these institutions can only sell these lets call them stocks. If there is panic selling and they sell all of them, grayscale will still be in custody of all the real Bitcoin that would have just passed hands. In reality the Bitcoins at Grayscale will be frozen forever but virtually they will keep being trading hands in the form of GBTC.

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I think that as an investor it's too good for those kinds of institutions to buy Bitcoin so that the demand increases and, in that way, the price increases as well. Besides, everything seems to indicate that in 2021 there will be more institutional purchases at btc.
Now, as a Bitcoin enthusiast, I think that those kinds of institutional purchases are negative for btc, because large investors have the possibility of manipulating the market and it's not positive that one single company owns a large percentage of the btc currencies. Anyway, we'll see what happens during 2021 with the price of Bitcoin.
 

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22 hours ago, cryptovlek said:

->Grayscale is buying as institutions ask for Bitcoin.

->It holds the Bitcoin forever in its custody and gives a share of the Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (GBTC) to the institution.

->Institutions can trade at OTC (over the counter) exchange. 

This is a legal representation of a Bitcoin. So these institutions can only sell these lets call them stocks. If there is panic selling and they sell all of them, grayscale will still be in custody of all the real Bitcoin that would have just passed hands. In reality the Bitcoins at Grayscale will be frozen forever but virtually they will keep being trading hands in the form of GBTC.

I was unaware of the technicalities behind institutional acquisitions, they are definitely investments orchestrated in a way that does not affect the market, let's hope this fever continues, bitcoin in this bull run is unstoppable!

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The threat in my opinion is only some big bad news that could happen. Bitcoin real volatility is the news of restrictions and regulations. If the US decided to restrict, or increase taxation, or even make KYC mandatory it could be very bad news.

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If the crypto market biggest shares goes in institutes hand then they will manipulate the price. And the small time traders will not gonna make profit because the market follow be in their hands like whales. But this time the whales will be white colour and the financial freedom claims will remain only claims for crypto adopter the centralised system will become strong against decentralised system and people will face same days like fiat economic system in crypto. This is alarming state for crypto community. 

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On 1/5/2021 at 4:25 PM, Obliv0n said:

what could happen when these institutions decide to liquidate their assets,

As I understand Grayscale, it will be impossible for this company to sell the assets back to the crypto market. The reason is it buys Bitcoin and gives something else, a share, to the customers. Then the customers trade these shares, but have no right to the Bitcoins. Grayscale also has no right to move the Bitcoins. It is very difficult for me to understand if this should have been allowed in the first place. It seems there is some kind of gap in the process.

There are these Bitcoins that Grayscale owns, they are worth +20billion. And then there are 20 billion USD in the GBTC assets too. This alone, makes it doubling the assets in existence. I am not so sure how this is allowed by any kind of economic model.

Also  the fact that nobody can sell the Bitcoin but only able to trade the shares makes it even more problematic. Especially for the reason that Bitcoin losses all the features it has this way. It is just for investment and not even able to be moved.

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I am my life in this topic. I cannot prove that there will really be a relationship between cryptocurrencies and financial institutions. also, I cannot say that they seek to disperse everyone and sabotage the network.
Some things if we were not among them we would not know.


Учитесь, учитесь и учитесь на своих ошибках :classic_smile:

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My dear, I see the issue very normal for several institutions to invest in Bitcoin or any other currency, as it is not legally prohibited and everyone has a fan and the spread of tangible wallets. The currency store is an interesting thing, as it has more encryption and it is safe because it is mainly beside you. Thank you very much

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Thanks to cryptocurrency ETFs, they can easily include bitcoin (and soon Ethereum) in their investment portfolios.   According to analysts, around 700 investment companies have already invested in such funds. Nevertheless, the share of institutional investors in bitcoin-ETFs is currently only about 10% of the total. Motley Fool estimates that if financial institutions invest about 5% of their assets in bitcoin, the market capitalization of the first cryptocurrency could exceed $7 trillion, which explains its forecasted rate of $400,000.   Considerably less optimism was heard in the forecast of Bloomberg senior analyst Mike McGlone. According to him, bitcoin's volatility leaves it trailing gold and the US dollar in investment appeal. Furthermore, he believes that stocks will soon crash amid the expected recession, but BTC will suffer even more than the stock market. McGlone emphasized that the Tether (USDT) stablecoin, pegged to the US dollar, typically trades twice as much per day as bitcoin. "I can access the US dollar anywhere in the world from my phone using Tether. Tether is the number one trading token. It's the number one cryptocurrency for trading. It's the dollar. The whole world has moved to the dollar. Why? Because it's the least bad of all fiat currencies," the Bloomberg expert stated.   While Mike McGlone merely downgraded bitcoin's attractiveness, Cardano founder Charles Hoskinson simply buried it. He equated bitcoin to a religion and stated that the industry has outgrown its dependence on it. According to Hoskinson, "the industry no longer needs bitcoin to survive." He pointed out critical threats to the leading cryptocurrency, including insufficient adaptability and dependence on the Proof-of-Work algorithm. Franklin Templeton analysts, on the contrary, consider L2 protocols, along with Ordinals, Runes, and DeFi primitives, as one of the main drivers of bitcoin's innovation revival. Strike CEO Jack Mallers defended the first cryptocurrency. According to him, the Lightning Network, created for instant and cheap transactions, a second-layer solution based on the BTC blockchain, can further increase the demand for the first cryptocurrency. Mallers believes that thanks to this, bitcoin can be used for everyday purchases, such as paying for a cup of coffee. Former BitMEX CEO Arthur Hayes called the native token of the Cardano blockchain (ADA) "dog shit" due to its low use in protocols.   As of the time of writing this review on the evening of Friday, 31 May, ADA is trading at 0.45 USD per coin, while bitcoin and Ethereum are faring significantly better: BTC/USD is trading at $67,600, and ETH/USD at $3,790. The total cryptocurrency market capitalization is $2.53 trillion ($2.55 trillion a week ago). The Bitcoin Fear & Greed Index remained almost unchanged over 7 days, staying in the Greed zone at 73 points (74 a week ago).   It should be noted that ETH/USD failed to break through the $4,000 resistance this past week. The local maximum was recorded on Monday, 27 May, at $3,974. The lack of an immediate pump is explained by the fact that everyone who wanted to buy Ethereum in anticipation of the SEC's historic decision already did so. Meanwhile, according to some analysts, there is a high probability that immediately after the launch of the long-awaited spot exchange funds, Ethereum will enter a deep drawdown, similar to what happened in January with bitcoin. Then, over 12 days, it fell by 21%.   One of the key reasons for BTC's drawdown at that time was the unlocking of GBTC fund assets from Grayscale, which was converted into a spot fund from a trust. It began losing investments daily at a rate of $500 million. It is possible that something similar could happen with Ethereum, where Grayscale's ETHE fund holds $11 billion worth of ETH. As soon as this fund is converted into a spot fund and its assets are unlocked, short-term investors might start taking profits, potentially causing ETH/USD to fall to the strong support zone of $2,900-3,200. Pessimists among bearish factors also cite the uncertain legal status of the altcoin, as the SEC has not yet clearly defined whether ETH is a commodity or a security. Additionally, the regulator has many complaints about the staking program.   Staking is a way to earn cryptocurrency by "locking" a certain amount of coins in a wallet on the Proof of Stake (PoS) algorithm to support the network. In return, the user receives rewards in the form of additional coins. According to Wall Street legend Peter Brandt, "the biggest disasters in the cryptocurrency sphere that are yet to happen will be related to staking." The expert noted that such assets as Ethereum are often rented out to earn such income, often in the form of interest, which strongly reminds him of collapsed financial pyramids. As staking becomes more widespread, Brandt warned, it could attract increased attention from central banks, treasuries, and other authorities. This could lead to tighter regulation, significantly altering the crypto space and potentially resulting in the cessation of staking and bankruptcies for those involved. NordFX Analytical Group   Notice: These materials are not investment recommendations or guidelines for working in financial markets and are intended for informational purposes only. Trading in financial markets is risky and can result in a complete loss of deposited funds.   #eurusd #gbpusd #usdjpy #btcusd #ethusd #ltcusd #xrpusd #forex #forex_example #signals #cryptocurrencies #bitcoin #stock_market   https://nordfx.com/ 
    • Даа, кроме нас на форуме остались рекламщики обменников и все). А у вас было монета not, он очень хорошо вырос. Надо было покупать сразу после листинга. Даа, упускаем моменты). Биткоин продолжает коррекцию делать, а я купил какие то щитки и вынужден ждать. 
    • Крупный банкир получил тюремный срок за криптомошенничество   Бывший инвестиционный банкир Рашон Рассел приговорён к 41 месяцу тюремного заключения за мошенничество с использованием цифровых активов. В результате расследования правоохранительные органы США выяснили, что обвиняемый начал опробовать свою мошенническую схему на друзьях, бывших одноклассниках и коллегах по работе в криптофонде R3 в ноябре 2020 года. Рассел обещал им гарантированную доходность инвестиций от 25% до 100%. Чтобы его слова были ещё убедительнее, он пустил в ход свой опыт инвестиционного банкира и сфабрикованные документы (поддельные счета, переводы). Сначала он использовал часть полученных обманным путём средств для выплаты долгов более ранним инвесторам. Остальные деньги Рассел тратил на азартные игры и поддержание роскошного образа жизни. Такая мошенническая схема работала до августа 2022 года. В апреле 2023 года Рашона Рассела арестовали, а в сентябре он признал свою вину. Тогда же выяснилось, что Рассел незаконно приобрёл около 100 кредитных и дебетовых банковских карт на имена других людей. По мнению следователей, он планировал использовать карты для проведения транзакций с полученными незаконным способом деньгами. Минюст США подсчитал, что потери инвесторов от мошеннической схемы Рассела составили $1,5 млн. Именно эту сумму подсудимый должен выплатить своим жертвам в качестве компенсации. Источник - https://ru.investing.com/news/cryptocurrency-news/article-2428894
    • CryptoRank поделился списком крупнейших разлоков июня.        Будьте осторожны в отмеченные дни, ведь увеличение предложения может вызвать давление со стороны продавцов. ARB — $105.21 млн;APT — $103.03 млн;UNI — $87.93 млн;STRK — $75.67 млн;DYDX — $66.3 млн;SEI — $63.81 млн;ID — $55.82 млн;IMX — $54.96 млн;MERL — $42.21 млн;ENS — $36.65 млн.  
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    • В Татарстане построят майнинговую ферму стоимостью $100 млн   В Иннополисе, городе высоких технологий в Республике Татарстан, реализуют майнинговый проект стоимостью $100 млн. Об этом на криптофоруме в Казани сообщил заместитель премьер-министра Татарстана Роман Шайхутдинов и заместитель министра цифрового развития, связи и массовых коммуникаций РФ Александр Шойтов.     В 2023 году Россия поднялась на второе место по майнингу криптовалют. По оценке экспертов, в майнинге может быть использовано до 5 гигаватт электрической мощности, что позволит стране занять лидирующие позиции в отрасли, — сказал Александр Шойтов.   В середине февраля компания по добыче биткоинов BitRiver также обнародовала планы по запуску крупнейшего в России дата-центра, ориентированного на искусственный интеллект.   В РФ пока нет чётких правил по контролю майнинга. В конце апреля российские законодатели представили новую версию законопроекта, направленного на регулирования рынка добычи криптовалют. По словам одного из его авторов, правила могут вступить в силу уже в сентябре этого года.
    • Линн Мартин выразила оптимизм по поводу биткойн-ETF, подчеркнув их потенциал и ресурсы, которые они уже принесли на Уолл-стрит.  Мартин, президент группы Нью-Йоркской фондовой биржи, выразила этот оптимизм на конференции Consensus 2024, когда ее спросили о запуске ETF на биткойны ( BTC ) и о потенциале, который они несут для Уолл-стрит.  «Мы ведем переговоры с SEC уже более шести лет о биткойн-ETF», — сказал Мартин в интервью . «Я думаю, вы не можете спорить с успехом биткойн-ETF и ликвидностью, которую они принесли базовому рынку».  Финансовые руководители все больше интересуются криптовалютой, либо напрямую, либо через ETF , что привело к росту цен на рынке криптовалют. По словам Мартина, одобрение спотового биткойн-ETF в январе пробудило интерес традиционных инвесторов, принеся на рынок много ликвидности.  Крипто-объединение Вашингтона и Уолл-стрит В последнее время на криптовалютных рынках и на Уолл-стрит наблюдались сильные движения цен, и во многом это можно объяснить сильным притоком средств в ETF, зарегистрированные в США. Рыночная капитализация криптовалюты превысила 1 триллион долларов с момента одобрения биткойн-ETF.  Спотовый крипто-ETF напрямую отражает цену конкретной криптовалюты и стратегически распределяет средства портфеля в эту криптовалюту. Эти средства активно торгуются на публичных биржах и отражают эффективность конкретной криптовалюты. Как и другие фонды, крипто-ETF легко доступны на стандартных фондовых биржах, и инвесторы могут хранить их на своих брокерских счетах. Недавно был одобрен спотовый ETF Ethereum , предоставляющий инвесторам регулируемый и доступный способ получить доступ к Ethereum. Могут последовать и другие спотовые крипто-ETF . Комментарии Мартин прозвучали в период крипто-оптимизма в правительстве США. На прошлой неделе Палата представителей США приняла законопроект FIT21. Законопроект разъясняет, как SEC классифицирует криптовалюту, создавая термин «цифровой товар» для цифровых активов. Законопроект направлен на искоренение мошенничества, регулирование криптовалютных бирж и защиту потребителей, одновременно создавая стабильную среду для криптовалюты — по сути, он сообщает, что криптовалюта теперь является проблемой правительства. Недавно Дональд Трамп начал получать пожертвования на предвыборную кампанию в криптовалюте, сигнализируя о более широком охвате отрасли политиками.
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